I use a similar approach but I don't used a fixed +1.3. I use the histogram to ETTR but the important aspect of this is to use a neutral camera profile as it gives the most "accurate" histogram. The image we see in the LCD screen or electronic view finder is a jpeg of the data with the processing of that particular camera manufacturer. Using a neutral profile to judge your exposure is somewhat analogous to using a linear profile in your editing software - it maximizes the data. Using ETTR with a neutral profile and a linear profile in Lightroom I've found I often don't need to do HDR at all
Well, this is what I would do as well but she uses incidental light readings from a light meter and not the reflected light meter form our histograms. Once the linear curve profile is applied your image will darken by approximately -1.3 . So you get a fresh starting point from here that is much more useful to advanced/pro shooters. Unfortunately, many times, +1.3 is a luxury I can't afford but the technique is definitely worth applying if you shoot in good lighting conditions or a controlled lighting environment with massive access to light.
Personally I am way too lazy to stroll around with a light meter in my pocket so instead I just set one of the programs in my camera to shoot a 0.0 and +1.3 bracket and completely forget about it until import. Then I make Lightroom apply the linear curve on import. 😬
P.s. How do you get a neutral camera profile in camera? From what I understand they are all somewhat (very) tweaked from factory. 🤔
All of the cameras have their specific profiles but they all like to call them slightly different. Look for the settings for picture style or picture control or creative style or custom image or something similar - within those settings they’ll have profiles labeled neutral or flat or something similar. The neutral/flat profiles are the least tweaked of all of them. With these setting and ETTR the image on the camera screen will look flat and overexposed but it has the most data so when you process it you get more detail with less noise.
Hmmmm, seems there is no such thing as that for Fujifilm. My only option is to remove the camera’s “little extra” with the flat linear curve profile in Lightroom or go Capture One. On a Fuji the default is Provia. Would not be a stupid thing to ask manufacturers to include a flat linear curve profile recipe. 🤔
I'm not at all familiar with Fujifilm. The only think I could find was this from a Google AI response
"Yes, Fujifilm has several flat picture styles. You can achieve a flat look in-camera with film simulations like ETERNA and PRO Neg. Std, which are designed for low contrast and a cinematic or muted appearance. For the flattest possible image, shooting in RAW format allows you to apply these and other looks in post-processing software, as in-camera JPEG settings don't affect RAW files.
In-camera film simulations
ETERNA: This is a very flat and cinematic option that pulls up shadows and lowers highlights, making it excellent for video or for creating a strong base for post-processing in still photography.
PRO Neg. Std: A flatter, standard option for professional-looking stills that provides a more subdued look compared to other profiles.
Monochrome: While not a flat color profile, it's considered a flatter and more balanced black and white option compared to others like Acros.
Tips for getting the flattest image
Shoot in RAW: The most important step for maximum editing flexibility is to shoot in RAW format. This ensures the full dynamic range of the sensor is captured, and the in-camera settings act only as a preview.
Use in-camera flat profiles: Apply ETERNA or PRO Neg. Std in-camera to get a preview of the flat image on your LCD screen. These settings will be embedded in the RAW file for easy retrieval in post."
To me it sounds like PRO Neg. Std would be the best option but as I say I'm not really familiar with Fujifilm.
Yep, been playing some time with my Sony, Fudj, Leica, Blad... and in the end they all seem to add some "spice" in there. I also compared the generated profiles with the linear profile on Capture One, except the Blad since they do not apear to be friends at all, and the result seemed the same at least.
P.s. I call Hasselblad "Blad" becuase by the time a photographer can afford one (applies to males only) he is likely going to have prostate issues... 😑
Thanks! But these still apply some corrections and they do not darken the image to what the linear curve does which is what I am most interested in. I was actually playing with PRO Neg. yesterday. Will see if I get close… 🧐
I went digital in ’03 and struggled at the start based on being film-drilled ‘shadows for negatives, highlights for slides.’ Early digital made for very noisy shadow lifts, so ETTR was the way and improved SNR by simply adding photons per well, but as sensors improved it became less critical, and I think ETTR got somewhat forgotten. A blanket ‘+1.3’ is probably not an optimum and different sensors, scenes and Lux levels will need experiment to determine an optimum.
Forgot to mention that you need to have a true linear profile to maximize the sensor’s capacities. Lightroom does not have it by default so you will have to make if yourself with DNG Profile Editor or use Capture One. Also to really squeeze all the juice out of it you have to expose for the highlights with a proper light meter.
In any case, even if you don’t go that far the differences on the noise in dark areas and edges would be very noticeable when printing large. For social media, not really.
As you say you can make a linear profile with the DNG Profile Editor. It's pretty quick and easy. Tony Kuyper also has a free repository of linear profiles if you don't want to make it yourself. https://goodlight.us/linear-profiles.html If you somehow have a camera that Kuyper has in his repository he will create one free if you contact him.
I use a similar approach but I don't used a fixed +1.3. I use the histogram to ETTR but the important aspect of this is to use a neutral camera profile as it gives the most "accurate" histogram. The image we see in the LCD screen or electronic view finder is a jpeg of the data with the processing of that particular camera manufacturer. Using a neutral profile to judge your exposure is somewhat analogous to using a linear profile in your editing software - it maximizes the data. Using ETTR with a neutral profile and a linear profile in Lightroom I've found I often don't need to do HDR at all
Well, this is what I would do as well but she uses incidental light readings from a light meter and not the reflected light meter form our histograms. Once the linear curve profile is applied your image will darken by approximately -1.3 . So you get a fresh starting point from here that is much more useful to advanced/pro shooters. Unfortunately, many times, +1.3 is a luxury I can't afford but the technique is definitely worth applying if you shoot in good lighting conditions or a controlled lighting environment with massive access to light.
Personally I am way too lazy to stroll around with a light meter in my pocket so instead I just set one of the programs in my camera to shoot a 0.0 and +1.3 bracket and completely forget about it until import. Then I make Lightroom apply the linear curve on import. 😬
P.s. How do you get a neutral camera profile in camera? From what I understand they are all somewhat (very) tweaked from factory. 🤔
All of the cameras have their specific profiles but they all like to call them slightly different. Look for the settings for picture style or picture control or creative style or custom image or something similar - within those settings they’ll have profiles labeled neutral or flat or something similar. The neutral/flat profiles are the least tweaked of all of them. With these setting and ETTR the image on the camera screen will look flat and overexposed but it has the most data so when you process it you get more detail with less noise.
Hmmmm, seems there is no such thing as that for Fujifilm. My only option is to remove the camera’s “little extra” with the flat linear curve profile in Lightroom or go Capture One. On a Fuji the default is Provia. Would not be a stupid thing to ask manufacturers to include a flat linear curve profile recipe. 🤔
I'm not at all familiar with Fujifilm. The only think I could find was this from a Google AI response
"Yes, Fujifilm has several flat picture styles. You can achieve a flat look in-camera with film simulations like ETERNA and PRO Neg. Std, which are designed for low contrast and a cinematic or muted appearance. For the flattest possible image, shooting in RAW format allows you to apply these and other looks in post-processing software, as in-camera JPEG settings don't affect RAW files.
In-camera film simulations
ETERNA: This is a very flat and cinematic option that pulls up shadows and lowers highlights, making it excellent for video or for creating a strong base for post-processing in still photography.
PRO Neg. Std: A flatter, standard option for professional-looking stills that provides a more subdued look compared to other profiles.
Monochrome: While not a flat color profile, it's considered a flatter and more balanced black and white option compared to others like Acros.
Tips for getting the flattest image
Shoot in RAW: The most important step for maximum editing flexibility is to shoot in RAW format. This ensures the full dynamic range of the sensor is captured, and the in-camera settings act only as a preview.
Use in-camera flat profiles: Apply ETERNA or PRO Neg. Std in-camera to get a preview of the flat image on your LCD screen. These settings will be embedded in the RAW file for easy retrieval in post."
To me it sounds like PRO Neg. Std would be the best option but as I say I'm not really familiar with Fujifilm.
Yep, been playing some time with my Sony, Fudj, Leica, Blad... and in the end they all seem to add some "spice" in there. I also compared the generated profiles with the linear profile on Capture One, except the Blad since they do not apear to be friends at all, and the result seemed the same at least.
P.s. I call Hasselblad "Blad" becuase by the time a photographer can afford one (applies to males only) he is likely going to have prostate issues... 😑
Thanks! But these still apply some corrections and they do not darken the image to what the linear curve does which is what I am most interested in. I was actually playing with PRO Neg. yesterday. Will see if I get close… 🧐
Good luck. It's a shame that they make this so difficult
:)
I went digital in ’03 and struggled at the start based on being film-drilled ‘shadows for negatives, highlights for slides.’ Early digital made for very noisy shadow lifts, so ETTR was the way and improved SNR by simply adding photons per well, but as sensors improved it became less critical, and I think ETTR got somewhat forgotten. A blanket ‘+1.3’ is probably not an optimum and different sensors, scenes and Lux levels will need experiment to determine an optimum.
Forgot to mention that you need to have a true linear profile to maximize the sensor’s capacities. Lightroom does not have it by default so you will have to make if yourself with DNG Profile Editor or use Capture One. Also to really squeeze all the juice out of it you have to expose for the highlights with a proper light meter.
In any case, even if you don’t go that far the differences on the noise in dark areas and edges would be very noticeable when printing large. For social media, not really.
As you say you can make a linear profile with the DNG Profile Editor. It's pretty quick and easy. Tony Kuyper also has a free repository of linear profiles if you don't want to make it yourself. https://goodlight.us/linear-profiles.html If you somehow have a camera that Kuyper has in his repository he will create one free if you contact him.